Weekend Cup O’Chiefs
Many years ago, some 30 or so, early Sunday mornings during the football season a car would pull into the driveway of the Haley house in Upper St. Clair, Pennsylvania.
A young Todd Haley would go out the front door and jump into the car. The driver was Steelers assistant coach Tom Moore, and he would be heading to downtown Pittsburgh for the Steelers pre-game meal on home game days at the downtown Hilton Hotel. Haley would hitch a ride. Sometimes so did Pat Perles, son of George Perles the Steelers defensive line coach/coordinator. The boys were on their way to Three Rivers Stadium to work in the Steelers locker room and on the sidelines during the game.
Today Haley is the head coach of the Chiefs. Pat Perles is on his coaching staff, working with the defense.
And on Thursday, Tom Moore (above right) retired as offensive coordinator of the Indianapolis Colts. He was joined by offensive line coach Howard Mudd (above left). Both men had 30-plus years of coaching experience in the NFL, and both men are out of the business not so much because they wanted to be, but because of changes in the NFL’s pension plan.
There are many twists and turns to the pension issue that has drive Moore and Mudd from their jobs, and some of those factors haven’t even been clearly defined yet. Basically both coaches were worried about the future value of their pension pots with NFL teams now allowed to pull out of the league’s pension program. The Colts have not left the program, but apparently nine teams have and that could affect the funding of the program and that could jeopardize that ability of Moore and Mudd to cash out down the road.
Understand that the pension plan for NFL coaches is one reason many of those in the profession have stayed working and put up with the uncertainty of where they will be employed from year to year. That Moore and Mudd have been in Indianapolis for 11 seasons is just about unheard of around a league where 11 teams changed head coaches from opening week last year. Every time the guy on top of the flow chart changes, there are multiple changes on the staff.
The portability of the NFL’s plan made the instability less of a liability. With that gone, it opens up a lot of questions in the NFL coaching ranks. Listen, most of the guys who get into the coaching profession want a chance to work at the pro level; that fact will never change. But for guys like Moore and Mudd who have spent 30-plus years in the league, this is a very abrupt change.
And their departures are a dagger blow to the Indianapolis Colts. The offense for the guys wearing the horseshoe has always centered on Peyton Manning, and then the likes of Marvin Harrison, Reggie Wayne, Edgerrin James, Joseph Addai, and Dallas Clark. They have been the guys in the limelight.
Moore and Mudd have been in the background, known and respected by those in the business, but barely acknowledged by the average NFL fan who just saw a couple of old guys on the sideline.
But they were as much a part of the Colts success as Manning and Harrison.
“It’s the combination of the coaches with the players,” Jim Mora told the Indianapolis Star this week. It was Mora who hired Moore and Mudd for his Colts coaching staff back 1998. “Sure, it helps to have had a quarterback like No. 18, but those guys are two really, really good coaches. It’s been a luxury for the Colts to have those guys for as long as they’ve had them. I think it would be a loss if they left, but I think they’d probably find a way to survive there in Indianapolis with the offensive talent they have.”
With talent like Manning, Wayne, Addai and Clark, they Colts will likely survive. The question is whether they will thrive without the elder statesman of the offensive machine. What the Colts have gotten done in 11 seasons with Moore, Mudd and Manning is remarkable. The Indianapolis Star worked up some numbers for that 11-year run that began in 1998. Here’s what the Colts offense has averaged in that decade-plus-one:
|
Category |
No. |
NFL Rank |
|
Points/game |
26.1 |
1 |
|
Total yards/game |
362.9 |
1 |
|
Passing yards/game |
257.7 |
1 |
|
Passing yards/att. |
7.6 |
1 |
|
Completion pct. |
64.3 |
1 |
|
Passing TDs |
340 |
1 |
|
Passer rating |
94.4 |
1 |
|
Third-down pct. |
45.1 |
1 |
|
Fewest sacks allowed |
214 |
1 |
|
Fewest turnovers |
271 |
2 |
Moore has been the man who worked hand in glove with Manning in putting together game plans that worked and allowed the quarterback to become the director of the offense. Mudd is the guy who has helped create the protection schemes and units that have consistently given Manning the time he needs to make the passing game work, while also making the running game a major contributor.
Mudd will also be missed because he’s probably the best assistant coach in the business at cracking another team’s defensive signals. While Bill Belichick was suriptiously filming opposing coaches as they sent in their signals, Mudd has for years been a guy who was able to crack the code on the field during the game. When Mudd was coaching the Chiefs offensive line for four years (1989-92), Marty Schottenheimer raved about his assistant’s ability to decipher what was coming from the other sideline.
Although Moore and Mudd are no longer part of new head coach Jim Caldwell’s official staff, either man or both may return as consultants. How that would work, and how it would fall under current pension and workplace rules remains to be seen.
Even with that possibility, don’t let anybody tell you differently: this is a huge blow for the Colts. Yes they still have Manning and the others. Yes, they will still be a contender in the AFC.
But things just got a little bit harder for the offense in Peyton’s Place, and for that the rest of the conference will rejoice.
SIGNINGS & MOVEMENT AROUND THE LEAGUE
FALCONS – released CB Ronnie P rude and S Marcus Paschal.
JAGUARS – released LB Chad Nkang.
SAY HAPPY BIRTHDAY …
May 16
Born on May 16, 1957 in Cincinnati was DE Curtis Anderson. He played six games for the Chiefs during the 1979 season.
May 17
Born on May 17, 1982 in Northridge, California was QB Matt Cassel. He joined the Chiefs back at the end of February in a trade with the New England Patriots. Cassel was a seventh-round draft choice of the New England Patriots out of Southern Cal.
Born on May 17, 1968 in Chicago was C Tim Grunhard. Drafted by the Chiefs in the second-round of the 1990 NFL Draft out of Notre Dame, he played 11 seasons with the Chiefs, appearing in 169 games with 164 starts. Grunhard was chosen for the Pro Bowl after the 1999 season.
Born on May 17, 1958 in Litchfield, Minnesota was LB Dave Klug. He was signed as a college free agent in 1981 out of Concordia College. Klug spent three seasons with the Chiefs, appearing in 26 games with two starts.
Born on May 17, 1946 in Miami was TE Morris Stroud. He was the Chiefs third-round choice in the 1969 NFL-AFL Draft, taken with the 76th pick out of Clark University in Atlanta. Stroud was 6-10, 255 pounds. He appeared in 69 games, with 49 starts, catching 54 passes for 977 yards and seven TDs over his career.
Born on May 17, 1978 in Ft. Wayne, Indiana was P Jason Baker. He kicked for two seasons (2003-04), appearing in 18 games. He punted 89 times for a 39.3-yard average.
Nice view from the assistants perspective on their retirement pension. The Colts sure did flourish under the tutelage of both those coaches. However, like with Dick Vermiel’s staff and all the ungodly numbers that they put up. The Colts only have one Super Bowl win to show for all those records.
Merwin makes a good point that illustrates two things. How difficult it is to win a Super Bowl and the fact that the best blueprint for lasting success includes balance in all phases. That’s what New England has done and hopefully we’re working toward. It’s a shame that the unfortunate byproduct of changes in the pension plan may drive some of the games brightest minds away at this time. However, change comes to everything whether we like it or not and the beat goes on.
How will this affect our OL Coach, Bill Muir, a very long time NFL Coach like those 2? Any talk of him getting out?
I think another sign of a franchise heading in the right direction is when your assistants are plucked from you. New England has had that senario happen to them multiple times. Same can be said for San Fran. I can’t recall any KC coaches taken from us since our Martyball years when Cowher was hired to coach the Steelers. I’m hoping Pioli and Haley can establish some good coaching lines here asap. There’s nothing better for developing young athletes than having the right coaches in place to get them headed in the right direction.
Alex Gibbs and some other good coaches defected from Schotenheimer to the Donkeys when Shannahan took over the Broke Back Mountain Boys! Then it was Shanny signing a butt load of our players and us signing a butt load of their cast offs….
its hard for me to feel very sorry for them. you know they made big money and will never worry about themselves or their family. I am a dairy farmer and worry about being able to feed my cows and keep the farm.. i would switch with them.plus what a great job to have ,, a NFL coach!!
“Tall tales & other truth stretched beyond belief”
Tomorrow, Sunday, May 17, 2009, Morris Stroud will officially turn 63 years of age. While he played for the Chiefs, he was also ‘officially’ (wink wink) listed at 6′10 255.
Mo aka ‘Tree’ was tall enough to be sure, but not that tall. He was listed at 6′8 1/2 when drafted, and true, sometimes a players junior year college height and weight were given back then. Still, he did not add another 1 1/2 ” over his last season before becoming a Chief. He was no more than 6′9, 6′8 3/4 his generally accepted verticality.
Beyond these specifics Stroud, height and weight fudging football is not unique to him or any one player. As is the case with measures, the tales too grow taller and yes wider by the seasons aft retirement.
Having previously discussed the “weighty tales” that could turn a 154 lb. dynamo like a Noland ‘Supergnat’ Smith into a 163 lb. heavy, we look at the skyscrapers that were in the 1960s world of pro football.
Ben Davidson is quoted on the Raiders site saying “I was it for a couple of years” after retirement claimed Bob St Clair; “he was 6′9″ & Doug Atkins “6′7″, Ben claiming ‘it’ meant he was tallest.
Hong Kong phooey…Ben was ‘never’ the tallest player in either the NFL where he began or the AFL where he later ended up.
Davidson was no more than 6′8 tops according to a source one but as short as 6′6 another (6′7 would seem to be the winning majority vote.)
In either case, Ben forgets or more so…does what Raiders do: “Ben”s the rules if you will.
Teams will not reduce a players height- typically they increase said…likewise, the case a little guy they may pump up the numbers. Limited cases, they understate weight (a Sherman Plunkett was listed as much as 322 lbs. back in the 60’s as a NY Jets OT aft he came over from the NFL Colts; he likely hadn’t seen 322 since last he saw his own toes back in high school.)
None of this is to question the ability a player, just the comical finagling that both players and teams undertake to create supposed ‘edge’ as it were…but how so & for whom? In the fans minds? Maybe; certainly not the opposition.
Unless the man preserving the interview with Ben Davidson entered the information incorrectly the players and measures referenced just do not add up…and of course, everyone knows Raiders never fudge or cheat
Ernie Ladd was a 6′9 DT who entered football the same year as Ben - 1961. Ben says “Ladd was 6′6 or so.” Ben’s errant in his mathematics. He does mention Morris Stroud & Richard Sligh, a 7′0 300 lb. DT who played 1 year in OAK in 1967, before leaving in the expansion draft CINN where Rich disappeared as well as any footnote in history can.
Yet, Ben does not mention Buck Buchanan, who was at least 6′7, & as tall as 6′8 according to some.
Nor does he mention Jim Tyrer - 6′6 for the most but 6′7 too one listing. There are others too.
While there have always been a legion of guys 6′5 or less, 6′6 or north said is when the herd gets thinned as it were.
The Chiefs drafted DE Bill Pickens in 1966…he never played in an official game, but was 6′10.
Ron ‘The Beast’ Billingsley was a 6′8 DE/DT for the Chargers & Ron Berger - 6′8, DE/ST Patriots, both of whom played back in the ‘67 -’69 period when Ben was playing; pull up a chair I’ve more.
Ben’s senior moments or the Raider way?
Chiefs coach Hank Stram would have signed a 7′1 TE back in ‘67 if the player had been willing… that player was named Wilt Chamberlain. He was a pretty fair basketball player too.
There are more I can recall but the gist is that whether through oversight, slight or too football teams doctoring the rosters- as if the opposition wouldst cringe at the very- a matter a few inches or pounds be not as important the excellence any player. If speed were the measure, WR Jimmy Hines and his 9.1 100 dash wouldst have equaled stardom for the Chiefs. Per se said is no different as to height/weight.
Stroud forged a pro football career, as Plunkett too, Billingsley and Berger et al - Ben Davidson too and his wax mustachioed ways.
So ‘Gentle Ben’ I believe you just forgot or, as with that signature moment yours ‘touching down’ a Lenny Dawson with a helmet yours into back his, I suspect you’re still looking for an edge as it were…once a Raider, always a Raider.
(PS) Ben, here’s a measure we can all agree on -
Chiefs 17 Raiders 7, AFL Championship, 1/4/1970
I’ve never really understood the propensity for teams to finagle a players height/weight.
As you said, it’s not unique to any one Franchise or Coach/GM, and certainly not new. However, I do think the slighting of #’s is almost as frequent as overstating them.
I try to use combine #’s when available. These #’s are real, but, after a rookie finishes his first training camp, you can cast weight #’s out with the garbage. Then, perhaps, it’s the coaches desired weight/height for said player that is given.
This is a practice that has out lived it’s usefulness. imo.
A few modern day Chiefs players worthy of ’scoff’ as far as their team listed verticality include:
* Brodie Croyle lists 6′2 206 (I don’t believe the first any more than the second…call me a cynic.)
That before last season began Brodie & the Chiefs were (paraphrasing) pleased about the addition of X lbs. - plural - of muscle yet his listed aft as before weight remained 206 reminds me of what the 1960’s comedian Jackie Mason answered when doctor his queried Jackie reference a ‘Rorschach Test’:
Doctor: “What do you see?”
Jackie: “I see that you need a new fountain pen!”
Case the Chiefs, they need a new slight of hand.
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* Tyler Thigpen 6′1 225
(no, x2. 6′0 on his tippy-toes, perhaps 215.)
If Tyler, Brodie and former Chief QB Damon Huard (listed 6′3) stood next to one another you could not locate 18 1/2 feet with a theodolite.
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* And the now ‘former’ Chief, Tony Gonzalez 6′5
(Gonzalez listed 6′4 1/8 at draft time - how he grew another 7/8 over the years is attributable to on-field heights reached, best guess (wink).
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Whether the old Dallas Texans routine of “copious rocks into pants pockets bring a spot won on this roster Corey and me (Walt & Stover, Smokey et al) such hijinks are a part of the lore of the game.
What grandiose heights teams they do achieve when artificiality be practiced to deceive… probably why the game is so loved
Bob, I’m pretty sure doggie poo is spamming your site.
Coaching change is good. It gives new, younger blood a chance. Guys like Gunther have been around in the ‘good ol boys’ network too long, and this pension issue might be enough to get him out of the NFL.
And yes anonymous, we certainly cannot but forget George Allen, combo OL/DL type who stood 6′7 and played one season in 1966 for the Houston Oilers while Ben Davidson was playing - said George was NOT the more well-known Allen who coached in the NFL for the Bears as D-CO ORD and later the Rams and Redskins as Head Coach.
Back to more Ben Davidson inspired tall tales… Gene ‘Big Daddy’ Lipscomb - variously listed 6′6 to 6′8 depending on source - was playing in the NFL when Ben was and too 6′7 Lamar Lundy of the Rams,6′7 Stan Fanning of CHIC and 6′7 John Diehl of the Colts.
And of course, the Chiefs drafted two big 6′7-6′8 behemoths in ‘67 when - yup - Ben was in the AFL:
Gene Trosch, a #1 pick and…oh, what was that other guys’ name…oh yes, Ed Pope - not to be confused with the long time sports writer for the Miami Herald.
The Chiefs might have forged a defensive line of:
Buck Buchanan 67
Ernie Ladd 6′9
Gene Trosch 6′7
Ed Pope 6′8
had dreams come true…alas, no.
I’m sure I can think of a few more if I decide to findthe- whoops, I mean Ben…when I do, I’ll be back then to share more football insights with a thirsty blogging nation.
On the opposite end of the Ben Davidson spectrum, (if what you say about the fudging of his height is true), is a guy like Emit Smith. He was generally listed at 5′9″ 213. Having met him up close and personal, or more accurately, he met me, (It was he that approached me) I would have said he was at least 6′ maybe a bit over, an experienced eye of “hoof weight” I would say 220 lb’s
Well there you go - not so much ‘again’ as Ronald Ray-Gun quipped - but as in “Shazam!”
Ay, there’s the rub…but the open sore become a wound that may not heal - the paradox ‘lying’ as well ‘lieing’ in the fact that the bleeding can continue even aft the patient is dead.
What does that mean? Really, I’m not certain but I wrote it once in a column when as Sports Editor opining about the 1987 NFL player strike and the replacement players; the memory embraces me now.
The ‘eyeball test as the eye witness’ notoriously as infirm as the consensus any as to what time is it… time zones & angles purview being unique to each, weight given to nee beauty being in the eye beholder, as twere.
As it is easy to gain poundage for many folks - I can go from my normal 178 to 182 aft a single big meal, so too a player (’less his name’s ‘Brodie’, appears.)
As we’ve covered the NFL / teams put out rosters that are - as concerns heights / weights - equal parts fabrication, imagination and mastication.
Emmitt Smith? You must have met him in Texas - everything is bigger down there…so they say.
Too, having seen Emmitt Smith stand next to Deion Sanders, I noted Sanders was taller - or at least he talked more, one or the other. True, it might just be all attributable to chicanery - no, check that - his chain-ery that blinded everyone in the vicinity as to what the where for was.
Here’s what the where for was, and how high, nee where the plot thickens…
Sanders was most usually listed 5″11, sometimes 6″0. So if the “5′9″ Smith ‘was’ in reality 6′0 or above, it must follow that Tom Landry was an even bigger legend of the game, as Tom too once stood next to Jimmy Johnson.
It’s…a point of football law.
That got a chuckle.
RIN start your own goddamn website and quit ruining this one! We thought after Herm was showed the door you went with him………….albeit you must have an awful lot of time on your hands!!!!!!!!!!!!
My, but your eyes are a lovely shade of green this evening…remember Dah-vid, pay attention to that which you’ve control over, and leave the others to their own device. Put another every discriminating person reads & enjoys me…or they read nothing at all.
Which is to say, tell it to the hand…move along.
That is all…for now.
anonymous says:
“That got a chuckle.”
- yes; like Emmitt, Dah-vid is funny…in an ultracrepidarian way.
anonymous
Oh, one last thing ‘anonymous’ (this at the risk your high-strung friend Dah-vid perhaps pulling out one of the last three his remaining hairs):
Sanders, Deion… case not of a Pinocchio growth spurt but perhaps an errancy in reportage.
Sanders has apparently grown - not to be confused with groan (or maybe it is)- to a grandeur of 6′1 now, according to aft retirement bios his aplenty.
This is, while majestic, nigh on vexing…as they say, all the girls get prettier aft closing time.
Sanders!
Only thing I will certify about him is, his mouth played much bigger than he did, especially when it came to the more manly aspects of football (tackling, blocking) he played small.
That’s no slight to his physical size, just his Heart and intestinal fortitude.
anonymous
As you evidence via worded familiarity, it is not a matter the size a dog in the fight, rather size the fight in the dog…
Not every can hit, take down and verily dominate green-tinted battlefields - gridirons or blogs - as Rin Tin Tin.
As for Deion . . . “meow”